Proposal: TransferValue - a transferable value system on SAFE

Yeah, that’s the question. There are over 63000 assets on Counterparty. Maybe we want to be a bit curious by making things to cheap? Once created it needs to be held in wallets.

I hope so, but I don’t think that this can be done without adding features to certain data_managers. The manager_groups need to transfer the value without change of ownership of addresses. That’s the big difference with other solutions where a coin is an address and can be exchanged.


I think that Mutable Data will have the ability to change ownership, so as far as creating an alt coin with MD you can send it via data managers just like you would with a safecoin. (I think I have that right) I’ll have to find the twitter post but in it, it said that MD will be able to transfer ownership, create alt coins, be used for e-voting, and allow for forum applications. And since Structured Data as well as pub/priv Appendable Data have all coalesced into Mutable Data I’m assuming Safecoin will be a Mutable Data type rather than the original plan of Structured Data type.


I would like to see crowdfunding and ICO’s (initial coin offering) on the Safe Network in the near future. Free idea somebody!! Made transparent and secured by Data Chains. I like how you’re really digging in and contemplating features @polpolrene. This and all your effort in the community testnets are really appreciated!


I actually hesitate but it’s a nice proposal.

I wonder if it’s actually a good idea not to lock an amount (certain price) of maid to create other assets. I see this as the only opportunity to keep the value of safecoin itself.
If the price is low then you get situations like bitshares , Omni,…

ColoredCoin I like much more to be honest.

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10 million SD x 4 copies. 40 million SD. Yikes. Great idea, but cost greatly. Not only that, the decimals are still not solved, even though there are multiple threads about it.

Think assets as “company shares.” That is really the essence of the whole system. But yes, the liquidity will be terrible; hard to move around since nobody wants it, and they all have one. The key here is making asset into a useful commodity that is highly tradable, like safecoin, or bitcoin.


No, this isn’t the idea. Look here:

It’s more like: 1 piece of mutable data for Alice her wallet and a group of datamanagers holding account of her balance. So it could be 10 million coins, 1 trillion coins, still just one piece of SD needed :relaxed:. That’s the idea, the transfer of value without creating a SD piece for each coin.


I thought @anon81773980 ment me with the greatly cost involved using colored coins … This makes sense and is absurd todo… I forgot about the 1sd=1safecoin principle…

You are using bookkeeping nodes in your proposal then. Looks cool :sunglasses:

What is your idea on keeping value of safecoin @polpolrene

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Ah okay. That does make sense now. It is a pure integer number, with one basic functionality that increment or decrement a value, using json or toml format. De/serialize it every time it is called to the data manager.

Hmm actually, this might be a much better idea than other proposals. It removes the complexity, and heavy resources.


That’s the right word for it! You should trademark that term :yum:.

I don’t know, this is apart from Safecoin. On systems like Omni and Counterparty they just use the blockchain tech to release their own coins. This is quite the same but without a blockchain.

Yes, the (client) managers already hold information on nodes about number of PUTs done etc. This is indeed just another value but with the option to move it from 1 person’s wallet to the other. Although, that’s the idea.

Not me, Antshares uses them to split the mining and the bookkeeping :grinning:

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Is MD free to update like SD was?

Since SD is not gonna be used anymore.

Want to know if SafeCoin will still have no transaction fees and if messages will be free to send after the first one.

Really liked those features of StructuredData

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Free to update.

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Yes, so far that is correct. I have a proposal (and coded it but since removed fro now) to allow a ledger bit to be set in data chains. So this means do not delete the older MD but keep it and create a new version. This would cost a tiny amount but as the network would keep an extra copy (i.e. the older version) then it would cost.

The idea for a ledger bit is for 2 things:

  1. Ledger data (so blockchain type capability if required) i.e. a data type that every update is recorded
  2. Individual ledger items, so even safecoin you could record and keep a transaction on the network. so for large payments, like buy a house or car then you can keep a receipt of payment and the network would always make this available.

Sounds great! And just so I understand, that ledger / receipt system would be optional, and by default SafeCoin is still free to send (receipt-less)? Thanks!


Will this ledger be public or private?

I can see lots of use cases for both public and private ledgers of this kind. Private ones would basically be ledgers that you could share to someone else and they could be certain that you hadn’t manipulated it, but you wouldn’t need to share it to the public. This would be necessary for many kinds of business transactions for example.


This is a Metaquestion that could do with a blog post from @dirvine as it may well be a thing before some of the other futuristic use cases. It plays into the questions of what is possible in a SAFEeconomy.


What would seem to be the obvious answer though is that it will have basically the same permission as the MD has.

That would at least bring up many new interesting applications. You could set a ledger to either completely public, like Bitcoin, or to be readable only by a certain group of people, a company etc.


The ledger type can relate to Private or Public data. So a full public ledger and public transactions, or private ledgers and private transactions. So just like the data types we have, the ledger can apply to any and give people the ability for public and private ledgers.

Hope that helps.

[edit, you can also use the ledger flag on a data type for a single transaction, so for instance to keep a “receipt” of a safecoin payment etc. ]


It does, has the documentation expanded in the Datachains area or still very much at RFC stage?


Still at RFC stage, but when we get this in code and perhaps update the RFC it will be much more clear. We will start shouting soon though, all going well :wink: