NVO Decentralized Exchange - Crowdsale


#41

Hi guys, I just read your whitepaper and IMO it’s an interesting concept but not fully decentralized because of the ‘Processing server’ concept. This processing server can be hacked or manipulated and letting only one of the trading pair transactions through. Also you have the problem of double spending on the Blockchain by using higher fees.

Maybe a solution for the ‘processing server’ can be that party A broadcast the signed transaction of party B and vice versa, ICW payment channels and/or escrow accounts…but I can’t oversee all consequences…

For the best solution we just need computation in the Safenetwork.


#42

The processing server won’t handle critical data, thus it would be pointless to hack it, the most important is to secure the validator.

The double spending problem is general issue to all the crypto currencies, especially for bitcoin due to the greed of the miners, the checking system ensures that no one will cheat on each other prior to send the raw transaction, the problem is that when it broadcast the transaction, there is nothing that can stop someone from double spending it.

There are several measures and solutions that could be applied, but none of the really ensure a 100% security from double spending, even in centralized exchanges.

For example, hiding the processing until the first confirmation arrives, or we could use a layer like Lightning to process the exchange, or we could use a third party hosted on the safe network to automatically process the orders as an escrow, but it will require computation capacities from safe network.

The main issue would be that for each solution, you have a counter party, and it may not suit everyone.The final protection won’t be available untill the end of the development. at the end we will add all the possible protections but we must do it gradually
Edit: we can use counterparty to solve this issue


#43

No we are not doing the same thing as shapeshift. The timer is for crowdsale.


#44

Thanks. Can you please explain how this is “secured by the safenetwork” if there is no safenetwork?


#45

Can you please elaborate on your question? Because the validator will be built and hosted into SAFE network, so there will be safe network.
What ever happens regarding safe network, we will always keep in mind that we must ensure the security of all the parties involved, and work on every possible aspect.
By the way, regardless of using safe network, Clearnet, or Darknet, you must always secure your applications, and it is what we have to do. There is nothing 100% secure in the IT world, as an example, Bitfinex had been hacked because of a simple unsecured GET input tag, this is why the developers are continuously providing updates to their releases.


#46

Sorry, I’m not completely understanding​ your response. So this exchange is not built on the safenetwork?

Let me ask another question.

Where is the Github repo for this project and for the lead dev? your Github link on your site redirects to Reddit or a slack invite.

Thanks


#47

He is the lead developer. Github link will be updated but the development of the project has not started. It’s still pre-crowdsale, so I am not sure you can expect from github? You can try out the wallet demo.

The validator used for the exchange will run on the safenetwork or the testnets. Just not a production ready exchange.


#49

Where is his profile on Github? He is a developer correct? With previous experience​ correct?

Thanks


#50

Hello, i would like to answer this question, in a direct way, i am a developer, let me tell you what is github for me, there are two user profiles on github. You have the users who wants to bring something to a community, and there are the ones who delivers products to their customers, so they can’t use a normal github account because of disclosure issues.
I walked for some time in the IRC of bitcoin-core-dev, you will find there some famous developers like gmaxell or lukejr. these developers pushes updates to the bitcoin-core repository, while there are other developers who are also highly skilled, people who worked with steev jobs for example or bill gates but they don’t have a github account but they help a lot the core developers.
Github is a collaborative development platform, and a source for open sourced projects, so if you work on your own, or for a corporation who needs a closed source software or service, you will never use github.
I feel that you don’t know much about development, but more on journalism or social medias, let me give you an example of a similar project.

https://bnktothefuture.com/pitches/exodus
http://support.exodus.io/knowledge_base/topics/is-exodus-open-source

The first link is about their ICO, there are no github link there, and they didn’t supplied it, untill now, you can confirm that exodus source isn’t 100% open, it is the second link, if you check the exodus repository, you will see some components they used for the wallet.
Now, have you checked the demo ? i did, and i got the source, and it is not uglified, it is maid of plain js files and html without any encryption to hide the source.

This was just to tell you that Github and social medias aren’t a reference for developers, it is more a reference about their personality, if they are philantropic (giving open sourced codes) or not, if they support a community or not, or if they want to preserve the privacy of their customers sources.

Alex from bitdice.me, opened the source of the front server who manages most of the operations made on his platform, while the most important one, the back end is totally closed, and he is succeding since 3 years, the customers doesn’t complain, and the investors are happy. It is a gambling website.

Answer this, is Bitcoin secured ? for now maybe, but in the future it won’t.
Will Bitcoin be compliant with safe network ? for sure it will.
Will safe network be delivered ? i am sure that it will as they had a genuin idea and the developers looks great, this forum reminds me of the early days of bitcoin when satoshi nakamoto was here address people’s questions.
If the future projects who will use safe network have security issues, will it be because of safe network, or because of the project’s developers ?
For sure it is the project developers who have an issue, not safe network. That’s why there is a crowd funding on this project, that will let them develop and secure the project and at the same time, they will be like married to their investors, and they will have to provide an excellent service, as their demo is.
@BIGbtc regarding your questions, it is like you aleready like the project, because it is seems that you are asking questions about the last stages of development, it is really nice.

do not hesitate to ask me if you have questions about what i wrote, i love this forum. as soon as i have more free time i will check the other threads.


#51

@nemgun 3 different members have asked for more background information on the developers, this seems to be met with resistance. I find this strange, if you are asking for investment provide answers to those who ask questions, do not avoid the question. I for one have decided not to invest based on this matter alone. This project is important hopefully you will not deter other investors who ask questions about the developers.
To me the team is equally if not more important than the idea.


#52

I can clarify about NDA part a well.I was part of multiple amateur projects before I worked under NDA with a public company from a vancouver and latest a fintech startup in france (still NDA I don’t have their permission to release details). Other company is a bitcoin public company called newnote with previously $30M marketcap and also for a blockchain startup which I also can’t release details because the CEO is unresponsive to my requests, but they are successful with direct competitors like Bitpay.

Yanni developed projects in the company ERMA who owns also the biggest research center in africa for light and street light. Yanni also worked and contributed to a licensed exchange that is still being developed. This details we can release thanks to nemgun for allowing us. http://www.veserus.com/about.php. So regarding our project on the exchange we have something to show as experience.

Anyway hopefully the rest of the people we worked for will allow us to release details but as they are closer to startups and don’t have anything to do with blockchain technology (expenses calculation and payment processors).

If this is a problem for you then you shouldn’t contribute to the crowdsale. All crowdsales are risky. We try to mitigate the risks, but if you can’t trust us then you shouldn’t trust us with your funds.


#53

We just submitted our passports to a company that may help us with the crowdsale and escrows so that can’t be any further from the truth. That’s fine if you don’t want to contribute to our project, but we are not hiding anything. I have worked with a public company that means everything that happens are published publicly through press releases.

We posted this mainly to collect feedbacks from other developers as the main goal is not to get investors that’s for later when the press release are out. It’s great we got the interests of some members.


#54

or

Which is it?

You know the developer?, you are the developer?, or you’re promoting an ICO on this forum that may or may not be built on the safenetwork by people that do development in secret for private companies that have never been heard of before and secretly partner with maidsafe china and from Canada?

You have no idea what I know and if I was pumping a ICO on this forum I promise you that I would be expected to demonstrate some level of competency in development. But Im not asking YOU for money, you’re asking me. You have not shown any capacity as a developer and that is expected.

You need to know nothing about me other than I know to ask all the right questions when you ask me to invest my money.

There are no answers here, only more questions with each post…

So far I see no reason to support this ICO.

Prove me wrong.


#55

Nemgun is not part of our project. I think you may have misunderstood him. He said he is a developer and provided with his experience regarding NDAs. He has nothing to do with our project and is just a supporter because we asked for the release of details regarding Yanni’s last project and he agreed on it which is the exchange to show we do have experience with centralized exchanges before we start on this project.

And no we are not asking for anyone’s money. We have our original source of investors we are just opening a crowdsale to see if anyone else is interested in joining. We are not hosting a charity. These ICO/crowdsales come with a lot of risks.

I think you are very confused. If it helps I can explain in details and prove that those companies do exist. It’s the matter of disclosing it publicly without consent of their CEOs. Unfortunately, only nemgun has answered to our request for disclosure and we are still waiting for several more people. Maybe a skype call would help?


#56

It would be beneficial to your cause to get some background on your team and accomplishments posted here. So you have NDA’s? No? So do it and present your facts here in this forum for everyone to see.

And YES you are in this forum asking for money.

As previously noted I’m 100% supporting this concept but IMO you are not in any position to be asking anyone for financial support.

Prove me wrong.


#57

We are not asking for financial support. If we are we would have implemented a minimum amount raised. People contribute to crowdsales mainly for profits not to financially support people like Yanni or I. I can assure you we are quite happy bagholding maidsafe for years to come without asking for anyone’s money.

We have already provided at least 2 companies for background information including the demo written by Yanni and more to come if the CEOs we contacted agree for us to disclose information. The lack of background information should no longer be a reason.

The crowdsale is open for contributions from anyone. The project will launch no matter how much is raised. If you feel it’s too risky at any point the best course of action would be to not participate.

This isn’t we need money so please invest in us. This is more like we are doing this if you want to pitch in go ahead if it succeeds we will share it with you.


#58

so, if you’re not raising capital… what is this ICO about ? Cryptophilantropy ?


#59

OK good luck, post back here with your development progress as soon as you can.


#60

so is there anything you can tell us about yourselves? any previous projects at all, etc would help

edit: got info, thanks for clarity. I understand some of the NDA, and other things have been mentioned above, sorry I hadn’t read everything in its entirety when I asked


#61

Everyone should treat this as a risky investment. It can fail and will have risks. In the long term, we are here to make profits from the exchange, as we see a potential that can be fulfilled by providing a superior product in a proven business model .