MaidSafe Dev Update :safe: 5th October 2015

Do you mean that a version of test-safecoins may suddenly become real safecoins if they turn out to function as intended? If that’s true, we’re going to see trading of test-safecoins at discounts and speculation on whether that test-safecoin version will make it. Devs with inside knowledge could use that to hoard test-safecoins in advance at the discount price to make a big profit.

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If that’s true then the safecoin exchanges are already working :slight_smile:

Seriously though, why not. Otherwise we need to say beta is over we need to kill all data and start again, otherwise folks may complain that they stored all this data for nothing and never got paid etc. So perhaps it is just a seesaw we need to consider.

I don’t think there will be discount safecoin in test, I imagine it will all be earned by farming and any early stage folks should be already in place. Or else we make a huge announcement and say to early adopters/followers etc. and say thanks for all the fish? Who knows the secrets of the black magic box.

Maybe a poll would be good, but I imagine early adopters should get the rewards of that adoption as bitcoin did, or any other such project.

Again we could drop the whole network and have a launch day and everyone clambers to start farming getting equality with early adopters, which may also stress the network more. Whereas slow start will be nice. All interesting points we will worry about very soon (next 2- 3 sprints)

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I like the idea of the rollout of safe coin to be somewhat random and unpredictable so it’d be harder for speculators to follow any conventional trends. If people are to put to the network before even test safecoin how will that work? Or will put be held off till test safecoin is implemented?

Yes, the very early (soon) network will allow anyone on without safecoin as a test (in fact the dns example is quietly making accounts and storing stuff for you at the moment). We will then intro test-safecoin (dropping all data in the process I imagine) and hopefully that goes well. Then people need test-safecoin to create accounts (so some work there for us to make this simple) and from that point it could become live at any time.

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Safecoins only exist on the SAFE Network and that goes for the test version also, correct?

If yes, I don’t see how people could trade test safecoins on the exchanges currently available.

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@happybeing besides running apps from the native OS, imagine going toward using the Launcher to target a binary file in Safe Network, and see the result in a simple Client UI on any device. So no need to download and install apps to the device. Source codes published for review, proof, and hash checked to be the correct binary, and never changing address. Something for farther down the road I hope to be sure.

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Yes …,

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it’s a simple matter of transferring ownership on Safe Network and also on the other asset, if it’s bitcoin then 2 bitcoin addresses will be involved and 2 Safe Network wallet addresses needed.

I see what your saying but I can see people with too much time on their hands trying to exploit the process to rip people off.

I see your point that it could be ridiculous to trade test-bitcoins for test-safecoins, and on one hand the test-bitcoins are funny money, and the test-safecoins end up being real safecoins. So then perhaps they should just not be exchange traded until Safecoin?

But who are we to stop people from taking the trades that they want?

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Huh what? The “Test-safecoin” should be non-transferable until “Real-safecoin” is ready.
This is ridiculous.

Why? This:

“Devs with inside knowledge could use that to hoard test-safecoins in advance at the discount price to make a big profit.”

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Hmmm. How would the devs get these test safe coins? Will they just issue some to themselves on demand or farm them like everyone else? The latter is not only acceptable, it is a natural (based on the SAFE protocol) reward for resource commitment. Testing these safe coin simply implies that we will go about using them as if they were live. Throwing them around for the sake analysis would be foolish. The only way the core dev would have an advantage is if all non developers adopt this foolish practice. Yes, treating test coin as it were live could result in possible wasted effort but their is risk that one accepts going in. Don’t worry, anything that you could lose is minuscule compared to what you will gain as an early adopter. So get your shit ready as if true coins will launch the day test coins are implemented. It wont be much longer after that the live ones will appear, so act accordingly. :neutral_face:

I too don’t see how the devs could exploit their knowledge here. They will have a better idea of when the network will go live, maybe a few days warning, or of the fact that it is at least some weeks or months away. How can they exploit this? I don’t see it - as @Tonda says, they only have an advantage over farmers who give up and throw their test Safecoin away, but then so does everyone else.

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Okay but I chose to be an early investor (Crowdfunding the project) instead of buying hardware.
This would help the team and I received coins in return. My “Crowdfunded” coins are locked up longer than the test-safecoin since they will be available/tradeable as soon testing starts.

They could buy them from farmers who don’t believe or don’t know for sure that the current version of test_safecoin will become real SafeCoin (instead of being wiped). If my guess is that there is a 40% chance that the current test version will become the real SafeCoin, it’s logical for me to be willing to sell these at more than 40% of the contemporary MAID price.

I’m not saying that it’s a huge problem, just wanted to mention possible consequences.

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I don’t think anyone said this, but transferable to what would be the question. There will unlikely be exchanges in test time and I am not sure if there was anyone would trust exchanging a test coin for something else. I am not 100% sure though, who knows what may happen. there may be exchanges using test safecoin as tests, but it would be at a cost in case they were not real safecoin.

The inside knowledge part is tricky, of course devs will know more, but they will not know what bugs exist or else there would be no test safecoin or unit tests :wink: I think just ploughing along and updating everyone every week will be enough to ensure we are all aware of what’s happening.

I imagine there may be scare stories and all kinds of knee jerk stuff around launch and safecoin going live, but all we can reasonably do is what we always do and that is be open transparent and honest. It’s also worth remembering MaidSafe the core team is a business and any attempt to defraud or use illicit means to steal would be a police matter with hard targets and directors etc. to go after. There is a pretty reasonable assumption that monkey business would be both morally wrong and criminally negligent.

Apart from killing what we have worked for it would not really help the project grow. So yes we all need to be vigilent and question all the manner of launch, but I don’t think people who support the project or bought msafe tokens (i.e. all maidsafe staff) would take kindly to mishandling of any “launch” so I recon we will be pretty safe, I know it will be delicately handled. Remember everything is open, including our meetings etc. so we do try and make sure we are keeping folks up to date.

I think when money is involved people get very nervous and it’s kinda understandable, just wait till launch and then see the accusations and allegations, they will make statues cry I bet, but that is OK. The crowd sale and crypto community have taught us all well for sure what to expect., but the network is much much more than the coin and the core team and supporters know this I am sure :wink:

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Well said! Not a worry in the world here captain. I invested in the future and am in it for the long hall.

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haul* (20 characters)

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I agree. Playing devil’s advocate, I guess the other issue is deliberate sabotage from inside MaidSafe by perpetrating a fraud and then allowing it to be discovered. Someone turned through blackmail or all the other ways security services are known to operate. It seems far fetched, but I wouldn’t want us to miss an opportunity to protect this project.

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Complete transparency with all things related to SafeCoin (or anything perceived like money) seems to be the most effective way to defend against this attack vector.

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