Looking for explicit answer


#1

Hello everyone,

My name is Jonathan, I live in Paris and I’m a senior software developer.
I heard of the safe network a few months ago, and I’m really interested in it.

I love this idea, I believe it is what the internet should have been form the beginning, but couldn’t because the world didn’t have access to the technology, now it has, now it is time for a true internet.

I’m concerned about the adoption of the technology. To be adopted a technology must be accessible easily. I use to call this the “mum test” : if my mum can do it, it’s all good.

Here are my main points, I do affirmations, please read it as "is it already the case ? if not, is it planned ? if so, at which point of roadmap ?

  • The network must be accessible from any browser, easily ( safe:// for exemple )
  • The connection to the safe network must be easily done through any language (sdk must be provided)
  • Content sharer (website webmaster for example) pay safe network resources. And payment must be legendary easy from coin and fiat.
  • Performance must be equal if not superior to current internet network ; it should be possible to pay more to prioritize the access to the resources and have greater performances.

Globally my point is : it must integrate smoothly with what already exists, otherwise it will just die.

Also, don’t try to create what already exists ( I’m thinking about SAFEbazaar, what’s the point except there is no authority so you’ve just created a heaven for fraud, drug & children sell ? ), and don’t break the law ( I’m thinking about SAFE-Med )

I hope I didn’t sound like a know-it-all who wants to tell you what to do, I’ve shared my view of what it should target to become mainstream.

Can’t wait to read you guys :slight_smile:


#2

Here’s my take:

It will be possible, but browsers and other software will have to integrate it to some extent. It won’t just run in any already existing app, that will not be possible. Basically the only thing you need is one connection point (the authenticator, eg), and every software that supports the Safenet will be able to connect to it via this point.
This could be a simple browser plugin, or the authenticator as a standard packet in every linux distro. It can even be a decentralised web access point if you’re really lazy. Though the security will be a problem this way.

Payment will be legendaryly (is that a word?) easy, except for fiat. But that’s because, well - it’s fiat.[quote=“JesusTheHun, post:1, topic:12824”]
Performance must be equal if not superior to current internet network ; it should be possible to pay more to prioritize the access to the resources and have greater performances.
[/quote]

If the network is large enough, it should be very fast. I guess, depending on what and how you measure, it will be superior to the internet now in some key parts, and will probably have some slower parts aswell. But the theory is that it should become faster and scale indefinitely.
No priorities, however! We want the same secure network for everyone, regardless of wealth.[quote=“JesusTheHun, post:1, topic:12824”]

Globally my point is : it must integrate smoothly with what already exists, otherwise it will just die.
[/quote]

That’s how Maidsafe sees it aswell. I didn’t know how important this point was until I heard about the Safenet and Nick and David talking about it quite a lot.


#3

yeah I don’t really agree with these requirements in the OP


#4

Can you share your view ?


#6

Hate this; it’s soooo anti-SAFE & anti-net-neutrality

It will but not right away, deal w/it :smiley:

DON’T rip the heart out of the biggest parasite of society (crazy high drug / medicine prices) ???!! WTF?? Where is your heart. And who said anything about breaking the law besides you? All we’re doing is building protocols and technology

No decentralised exchange?? I’m done :stuck_out_tongue:

IDK which agency you work for but I (respectfully) hate your viewpoints :stuck_out_tongue: they blatantly go against everything this technology stack stands for


#7

I’d have to concur with @whiteoutmashups as we don’t want traffick throttling or catering to any particular government. Not only are these things counter to the concept of freedom but they’re impossible to impliment without compromising security. How does one “not break the law” if one can’t determine where one is from in the first place? On safe it would be very difficult to determine jurisdiction let alone if anyone has committed any crime within any given jurisdiction. Hello, anonymous encrypted communication and currency exchange. For all intents and purposes there is no law unlesss users agree to opt into using one.


#8

Hey Johnathan,

Sorry that you’re getting the sharp end, but I’d have to agree with the points made too.

As many laws will be broken for good as bad, and it’s inevitable given the conflicting natures of regulatory compliance and anonymity, self-determination/freedom.

Using SAFE will be super easy and simple enough for any grandma we hope. Tick that box. Performance too, especially given part of performance is security. No need for any non-neutral access, you pay for the resources you use but it is Secure Access For Everyone, not just those who have a lot of coin.

And we will need to reinvent most of what exists on clearnet. On SAFE the paradigm is different, so all those big sites like FB have no use for a space where people own their own data, but we have great use for decentralised social platforms and exchanges etc. I think we will see versions of SAFEbazaar type Apps. And they will be a lot better than openbazaa because the clearnet and btc use plasters to obscure all the problems where SAFE solves the issues by design. In fact, I’d be shocked if openbazaa didn’t just port over to SAFE within a few months of realising how much better their platform works on SAFEnet using exclusively SAFEcoin.

Anyway, don’t be too put off by our defensive tone. We’ve all been talking and arguing about this stuff for a long time so we are quite set in our opinions now. Welcome to the community. I hope you can sympathise with our point of view! :slight_smile:


#9

Thanks for your responses everyone. I don’t get offended and I’m very glad you speak your points out loud.
I won’t put a name on responses but you’ll get it :slight_smile:

I do agree that the nature of the network itself is in conflict with the notion of regulation. Yet I think encouraging stealing medical patents or technology is no good for anyone. I don’t know where you all live, and I understand medicine can be expansive, but that’s something with our societies not with the fact that things have cost. Even a neutral network has cost.

When I said “pay more to prioritize access”, maybe I need to clarify : I meant the possibility to temporarily allocate more resource to get a file or run a process. I don’t see how this is anti-safe nor anti-net-neutrality. I’m a user, I’m good with the network, webmaster pays for hosting, but right now I want to download a big file from his website, he won’t pay for high speed. I’m ok to pay for it. What’s wrong ? If I pay more, currency goes it, so it costs more fiat, so people who share resources will be encouraged to provide more resources, the system regulates itself. Everyone wins.

Simple payment. Even in fiat. Build partnership. I have serious doubt that my mum will register on kraken to buy some maidsafecoin (which they don’t have registred btw, shame on them) to access or buy anything on the safe network. Same goes for bitcoin for example one might say. Yes ; be better than other currency.

I’m downloading openBazaar right now, maybe I miss something when I say there is nothing more brought by those.

Is there any map of current achievements arnd upcoming ones ? The “roadmap” on the maid website is quite vague.


#10

Admirable response! I wish I could be so mature - I get defensive.

Two.points to make. Firstly big pharma is pretty evil and the way the patents economy works is not a necessary evil imho. Second, I agree about encouraging any kind of ‘crime’. But I doubt anyone here is stupid enough to openly encourage any law breaking… which could get them into trouble.

Ok, well you do pay for the resources you use and you can use more or less of whatever. There are no ‘fast track’ systems though. Much like the current internet we will all be limited equally by the network resources that serve us. When you dl a torrent you get all those little packets from lots of destinations and the speed is determined by your connection to them and theirs to you. If you were to somehow prioritise some people’s access then it would create net-neutrality kind of issues. It would be at the expense of other users, who now have a worse service. I’m not sure it would even be possible given the network architecture, but I’m no way near techie enough for this, so I’ll leave it there.

This is the beauty of the network. No one needs to buy safecoins and in fact, we hope very few people do! Your mum can farm her own coins with half a dozen clicks. Just leave your pc on and come back a few hours or days later to find you have some safecoin and can now do whatever you want on the network. Finally she can store pics of her grand-kids without worrying about them being lost ever again.

I agree completely. SEPA transfers to buy btc and crypto exchanges would put almost everyone off crypto. SAFE users won;t ever need to buy or sell their coins. The hope is they use them and burn them in the process, then they farm more and keep providing resources to the network.[quote=“JesusTheHun, post:9, topic:12824”]
Is there any map of current achievements arnd upcoming ones ? The “roadmap” on the maid website is quite vague.
[/quote]

Best just to keep your eye on the updates each thursday evening. We’re hoping for test15 tomorrow which should morph into alpha two within a few weeks if it is stable. The updates are full of info. Check back through the forum for the development history. They make a good read.

:slight_smile:


#11

Hello and welcome to Safe !

don’t break the law

I would compare the invention of the Safe network to the invention of books in this aspect.

So suddently we have books, and people can do really bad things that break the law: they can write defamating words, they can reveal private , corporate, or state secrets, they can write reciepes for bombs, or publish classifieds for organ market.
Their use of the book technology is really bad in regard of ( some ) laws, or in regard of ( some ) moral or ethical values. But the book technology itself is not the fault here, it is simply unaware of what people use it for.

Safe will be the same. Some people will use it for the best , some for the really ugly. Unfortunately for our moms, the test will fail here !

But the creators of the network can not be blamed for what people use it for , just like we can’t blame Gutemberg for the vast amount of really, really bad books the exist around the planet :slight_smile:

In my opinion , this is a good thing. True neutrality combined with anonymity will arise in numerical publishing with Safe, and some people will use it to break ( some ) laws for the benefit of us all. Think whistleblowers here , for instance.

You could also think of the situation where someone lives in a very repressive country , and lives under laws that prevent them to publish anything related to political opposition. Before Safe , tbey would break law and go to jail or torture. After Safe they will break law and have a chance to live happy with their children.

Law is not always synonym of good !