I don't get it, why can't ad be run on the SAFEnetwork? It can be like Brave!


#41

I block all ads. What am I missing?


#42

You are correct, it will not prevent ads. It is a mechanism / network which will give users more choice than they have today. The freedom of choice to choose apps etc. The secure and private choice to directly speak/share with friends and with no intermediaries. This is the key and yes you are correct.

With that choice, I would hope if a facebook for instance appeared and people did use it with trackers etc. then something bad happened, that switching would be very simple. I would hope that apps though do not try and control folk, but are truely open source and openly developed and forked at an incredible rate as well. I believe massive forking will help apps deliver their vision and if it is a good value proposition for many then forking and many devs delivering the functionality will be great. Much like video players, email clients (of old) etc.


#43

This is getting to be a generational thing between those who remember dial-up modems and the open Web and those who have only ever lived in megacorp information silos.


#44

All of the above, except not scraping. You create and curate your network, you choose what filters apply, you choose how this is presented etc, all through the separation of application and data. You own the data, so choose how it is presented (which app = which filters, presentations etc). Don’t like how one app does this? You can switch apps because: no vendor lock in, no loss of your data or social graph.

I’m not sure where this came from, I certainly haven’t argued that it can or should, only that the power of advertising is a function of money which buys more advertising power, leading to a centralising cycle (a positive feedback loop) that has become harmful to society in various ways, several of which have been mentioned.

What I do argue for is providing alternatives which have more pros and less cons than an advertising based revenue model. I don’t believe advertising is essential as some have argued. While I agree with those who see a small advertising reach as useful and benign (David’s small trader shop fronts for example). But that is not where we are.


#45

The html 5 standard includes a javascript method for getting a users country. It will ask users for permission to get their location.

In chrome this is implemented through the browser sending a user’s ip address to Google’s geo location service that returns the users location to the browser. Many websites implement their own geo location service and thus doesn’t have to use the one built in the browser and doesn’t need to ask permission.

On SAFE a SAFE web app can’t implement its own geo location service to get a users location without permission, but it is possible to create an anonymous implementation of the html 5 geo location standard in the browser, for example by letting the browser know of a list of ip ranges and countries, either included in the browser or on the SAFE network. I think this would be quite useful. An app could then, like today, make a popup in the browser that says this website wants to know your location, you could restrict the location to only contain country information. If this is not implemented then websites that needs localization will instead show users a long list of countries to choose from, which is less user friendly.

Anyways, this has nothing to do with the SAFE network per se, it’s only about the browser. At some point I would guess there will be multiple independent browsers.


#46

On the current internet you can buy traffic, through companies like


You could put up even the default index.html on the SAFE Network and buy traffic to get rewards.

popular apps and sites are paid directly by the Network according to how much they get used.

I wonder if popular apps get rewards from traffic of “logged in” accounts (hmmmm how would the network know this?) or just when you get traffic on your SAFE site?


#47

And if this happens to the extent it makes things worse, we don’t do it.

You are pre judging the issue because it will only happen if the rewards are great enough to make this worthwhile, taking into account the cost v rewards, caching etc. Even if there is some of this, it could still be useful option, so we should wait and see what the pros and cons are when we can decide details and do tests.


#48

Edward Bernays = Propaganda, mind and population control, and manipulation. You don’t give us enough credit for understanding the true nature of “advertisers” and their sponsors who tirelessly inundate us with their lies. We are on to you guys. I don’t believe a damn word of what you have to say anymore. Good is bad, hot is cold, up is down, etc.


#49

Yes, this is exactly right; much better phrasing. Thanks!


#50

Yep, thats a no-brainer really.

You have specified a project you can develop for yourself. create the app/browser that distributes safecoin to the users who want to see adverts. There is nothing in that that requires the safenetwork code to change.

Congrats you have found the next million dollar application for the safe network. And all those who wish to see adverts can use your app/browser. If as you say people want this then you are going to be really rich

You need to educate yourself. Its absolutely and truly unnecessary for the core code of the safenetwork to implement this. Why not charities, school fundraisers, and a thousand other worth while things that need to be funded.

Its obvious! The network does not discriminate between these and PtD/P provides the mechanism that all these can be accommodated and/or implemented.

What you want to do is a pure Application level application and as such you can be rich if you write it. So put your efforts where your claims are and build this multi-million dollar App. Or don’t you believe enough people will use it. Or do you believe that only if people are forced to watch adverts that this can work?


#51

Gotta say I share Bill Hicks sentiments when it comes to advertising and marketing in general.


#52

Advertising is the antithesis of viral spread because viral spread is driven by organic promotion whereas advertising is contrived promotion.


#53

If you would like to look down the rabbit hole in regards to advertisements this may become a different conversation, so I would like to leave you this.

The Century of Self Good to watch to see advertising effects on masses.
Just Talkkin


#54

This is a long thread - and I skimmed, so I may be repeating something already said …

I get that SafeNet will offer a way for people to share without ads - so more choice for those developing sites/apps. Interestingly though, I use ad-blockers on the clearnet and I wonder how effective any future ad-blocker would be on the Safe Network. It seems to me that SafeNet will make it quite difficult to block ads by traditional methods (blocking ad domains mostly).

Could SafeNet end up being even more friendly for advertisers? I wonder.


#55

What I like about SAFE is that those who wish to watch adverts will be able to use @foreverjoyful’s APP/Browser that I am sure he will write and those who don’t want adverts will use APPs that do not have adverts.

Also for those sneaky APPs that inject adverts without classifying themselves as an APP that has adverts, I think that an advert blocker will work. It will use a list that has the MD addresses containing the advert material and block the access of those MDs. More than likely it will be a client mod or an addon if addons are invented for the client.


#56

No, we have money as a means of controlling people now but we need to reduce it to a means of exchange. Its an old formula, reduce waged and increase debt to get control.

Here is the thing. Others don’t have a right to my attention, especially not without my permission. You can’t sell that commons. Our focus or attention will define us. Our attention is the final currency. But currency always boils down to a tax and taxes are ultimately just a glue, all they do in the end is create group cohesion through identifying with a group. Taxes drive nonsense into people’s head, stuff like: I am an American. Its the blood of a group ego.

Word of mouth is fine (Tesla) as is better open honest ad/sponsor free search. This holds because self definition ( silly I know) is about volutional exercise of attention. Who can buy your interruption? And who can secure your consent but you. Its all opt in by default. At a minimum our attention would be too expensive for any of these swindlers, one of the reasons they try to condition children.

The future of the state might be something like: watch ad free porn or sports or something having to do with the society 4hrs per week and that is enough identification with society (a peace keeping function) to get your high indexed GAI and fully cover the base of Maslow’s pyramid.

What the American shills above are arguing for is a right to exploit. Its what Jefferson Davis wanted to allow the South to continue to slave. Its about stealing the personhood from people and treating them as property. Gunna sell you some petrol you don’t need, if not gunna enclose you and force you to buy it like Brits forcing the sale of their salt in India. Got to be able to purchase your attention and your censorship and your laws in order to oppress.

Ignore my psychopathic idiot countrymen they’re running on willfull arrogant ignorance and unjustifiable elite entitlement. The are in crisis because its been at least 50 years since elites could justify anything including their own status.


#57

I see some type of opt in advertising where the end viewer gets paid in SAFECoins to watch adverts instead of websites.


#58

Imho a UBI is the most interesting problem that we could solve at the moment, sure farming SAFEcoin is also a form of UBI, but not everybody will be able to farm. That’s why it would be fun to create a UBI for people who can’t farm. Honestly, I’m being hated here for working on a ad platform by some devs, because they probably think that I’m creating a evil ad empire. I’m just creating a UBI with a twist.

The self-serve ad platform is pretty simple.

Alice wants to visit a art gallery in her city and opt in for sucha ad. (Alice adds her city, the app doesn’t even need to do a location check (I hate tracking), the advertiser adds a category and a city and since these are the same Alice is shown the ad and get paid directly by the advertiser)

Bob doesn’t want to see ads at all (Opt out is default setting), but does want to be remembered of Alice and him loosing their money on MtGox, that’s why he got their picture as a background.

Chris idea of the ad world “Advertising platforms and advertisers should burn in hell”, Chris only use the wallet.

Who is to blame if people want to remain a clueless consumer? Ads are just a tool, be happy if you can consume, some people can’t and I have more sympathy for the needy.


#59

Well then @foreverjoyful will have to use another method for his advertising App/Browser if he is going to make his million. I am sure there will be a few different models that can be created for those wishing to see adverts.


#60

What you are arguing for @Warren, cannot exist. Money will always buy power. As I said above, the rich will just purchase product placement space on marketplace apps, which is defacto advertising, and generally has the highest ROI of any advertisement type, save viral marketing, but that’s incredibly difficult to get right.

I’m not saying I love ads, I don’t. However, they serve a very particular purpose which is not necessarily evil. Niche products or small shops can benefit greatly from advertising.

I’d be fine with a platform that allows an opt in with ads paid to the consumer via Safecoin or some other coin created specifically for that purpose. I think that’s a reasonable compromise, and it sounds like that’s being worked on.