Correct not UK but a perfectly valid point , That is some pretty insane stuff .
While it is unknown currently i would guess like everything else it will be counteracted and able to be gotten around , give it some time . I would more observe their actions once countermeasures and understanding of what is being done have been made more vocal. How fast will they then adapt to it , i suspect it will be a snail pace .
Too right mate!
I first got interested in SAFE via a post on Reddit. It was later that I found out about s/coin and it just verified this was exactly the type of tech that will push us forward and into the future.
I think safe coin fits in with the âinternet of thingsâ concept meshed for commerce, I can only use my imagination what could be possible. Unlike bitcoin safe coin bypasses all the third party as a crypt o-currency and the abilty too see pay as you go functions with the right app development.
I believe some very clever ideaâs will develop into the future with the use of smart devices.
Well, Iâm a much bigger fan of being proactive rather than reactive - it typically leads to healthier results. And what Iâm hearing is that such divisibility would be a reactionary measure.
Plus all the reasons why it would be technically hard to implement - taking not just developer time but also questioning the underlying functions of the Network and vaults, etc.
I guess the open-ended question is: Are the amount of PUTs on the Network directly correlated to the economy in which Safecoins are used?
The short answer is⌠Not really.
The amount of PUTs only account for âSAFE storageâ activity. P2P transactions beyond SAFE storage do not trigger PUT activity.
If Safecoin is more spendable, it will have a greater chance for mass adoption.
But donât worry, we have already brainstormed several solutions to keep Safecoin spendable, should the fiat value rise. We can make change by using the one of following:
#1 (Direct Dvisibility) is the most desirable but could have some drawbacks. It increases the transaction workload on a small Network. We expect this to resolve as the Network grows overtime.
#2 (SAFE GB) is naturally inflationary and its smallest unit of account is nearly worthless. IMO, itâs the easiest to implement. But it also competes with SC as the more spendable currency, just like your M-Pesa example.
#3 (Tier System) uses an escrow solution that freezes Safecoin when converting up or down tiers. This could reduce transaction workload. But it might confuse new people, not familiar with the different Safecoin tiers. It is also subject to different fiat valuations. Gold and silver do not have the same relative value even though their supply ratio remains stable.
âFor both Bitcoin and prepaid cards, the Commission will propose new rules by the end of June forcing the identification of their users.
Users of virtual currencies may have to provide personal data when exchanging Bitcoin for real currencies. Consumers may be obliged to provide their identity when buying prepaid cards, a move that is currently not always required across the EU.â
Ok, so it sounds a bit like there could be new legislation coming that might empower govts to attack things like safe coin/net? Yes, I know safecoin doesnât have to be exchanged for fiat, but itâll have very little value in short term if it canât be. Obviously thereâs no way to know exactly how this will play out, but we know they like using the anti-terrorism card at every opportunity and the inevitable âsafesilkroadâ will make safenetwork a very obvious target. Govts and big business will fight universal, cryptographic empowerment because it comes at the expense of their own power/control.
I really want to find out more about what kind of vulnerabilities they might be able to exploit and how SAFE might be able to make itself indestructable⌠surely there must have been discussions on this in the past that I can go back and read through? Does any kind soul have 5 mins to help point me in the right direction, so I can do a bit of research to put my mind at ease? No one else seems very worried so I guess I just need to educate myself to understand why everyone isnât.
ty in advance 
[This turned into a much bigger post than I intended, but oh, well.]
I think there are a few things to consider here:
Safecoin will have its own ecosystem regardless of extra-network uses. It will be generated by all people in small quantities and be useful on the network. The degree to which the network is cool and useful by its own right, will be the leading edge of adoption, not safecoin.
Aggregating large quantities of safecoin will be a challenge at first, because it is being created so granularly across the population. So big purchase interactionsâlike for illegal drugs, etc.-- will be difficult and not at the fore to begin with. Getting safecoin for fiat will have to be a very local, interpersonal, grass-roots activity at its basic level. This will gradually change over time, but only as the network matures and adoption becomes more universal. Iâm guessing that this will get more and more people used to going around government/corporate choke points as a matter of inconsequential actions, and start to establish an independent market atmosphere.
Truly decentralized exchanges, like SafeX, should start to facilitate all sorts of direct interactions amongst people. These will start on the on the level of exchanging safecoin and other crypto for each other, as well as for other digital values, like music, films, ebooks, etc.
SafeX and others will also facilitate small item commerce on a decentralized basis.
I think that these and other factors will allow SAFE to grow and establish itself without drawing much fire till itâs way too late to act against it, similar to how bitcoin grew and is now being adopted (and co-opted) by the banking/govât complex. Except that SAFE is so decentralized that once it comes on the radar for major purchases, it will be way, way too late.
Imagine that people are trading safecoin with friends and acquaintances for a couple eggs, a few bucks cash, a joint, etc. There is nothing âheinousâ to attack there. A campaign against SAFE at that point will just drive awareness and adoption, especially if the network is providing content, private communications, a safecoin return, uncensored news, etc. This leaves govâts attacking with the message âYou are not allowed to engage in voluntary interactions or communications of ANY KIND without our permission.â I think that is a great message for govâts to be spreading, because that is what they think and it is very rejectable by individuals when it gets down to it.
I think there is a very good chance that the powers that be will treat SAFE very much like Bit Torrent. Torrenting is unstoppable, itâs growing, itâs eating their lunch, and they donât dare say anything much about it because that will just hasten their demise if they make a big deal about it with a broad campaign. They can nibble at the edges of those they can threaten for using it, or people like the Pirate Bay founders, but they canât do anything effective to stop it.
I think the SAFE Network will be even better. Technologically, it actually IS BitTorrent on hyper steroids.
Much appreciated for that Fergish. Very informative and interesting.Thanks for taking the time to give me a thorough answer.
I do still think safe coin/net is more of a threat than bittorrent and using terrorism and drugs to vilify it seems like an obvious choice for powers that be once it has become established - even if no terrorism and hardly any drug dealing is actually taking place. If itâs all anonymous and private then they can claim ridiculous estimates for whatever they like to justify whatever they like, it would be nothing new.
I really hope youâre right and Iâve just been hanging around with too many of the tin foil hat brigade lately. The government are generally incompetent and very slow to act, but you never know when they might surprise you; underestimating your adversaries can end in tears 
I really hope youâre right though, SAFE is the best practical step towards a better society that Iâve come across⌠in my obviously unqualified opinion to make that proclamation 
Iâd be heart-broken if it were stamped out.
Iâm not really concerned about vilification for âillicitâ uses, real or not. I donât think black PR will have any affect on the network other than make it grow. It wonât be a threat till itâs proved itself and once itâs proved itself itâll be too late to stop it.
And remember, weâre pretty much just âbelieversâ here, not to be taken too seriously. Bitcoin is a real threat to be managed, here and now, which HAS proven itself. Other cryptos fit in there, too. Dash, for oneâanonymous, fast transacting decentralized currency which is growing at an impressive rate. What weâre doing here is a pipe dream as far as many are concerned. Perhaps theyâre right even. But us insiders have good reason to believe. And SAFE IS whatâs needed.
This line reassures me more than anything tbh, as long as it might be possible to make safenet very resilient when it gets a few million users.
Who knows how each govt will respond to crypto now that theyâve had a while to get used to the idea? China is making their own, but surely it would be hard to corrupt crypto currency to the fractional reserve system, or the QE crack machine that the rest of the worldâs central banks would probably insist on keeping⌠maybe theyâll just âmintâ new coins based on loans instead of mining, staking, farming etc, Ah yes, I see it now, a central bank owned, permissioned blockchain for another debt-based economic horror show. Sorry, getting side-tracked lol 
Thanks again for your thoughts dude, much appreciated.
Also wonât those laws in the EU be aimed at commercial enterprises that provide pre-paid cards and bitcoin.
I donât see how they can target person to person exchanges.
Thatâs why I get so jazzed about how safecoin will likely evolve. Aside from exchanges to the network for PUTs, small person to person exchanges will be how it HAS to start. Nobody except crowdsale participants will have enough to do larger ones. And even if a drug dealer wants to use it because itâs such a slick currency, heâll have to go buy it from people for cash to get enough to mean anything. That will create local markets and reasons for people to keep running their vaults.
Can you imagine a govât promoting safecoin and the network in any better way than saying âDonât sell your safecoin for cash, because those nasty drug dealers think if it as even better than cashâ?
I have this issue bugging me. Say Joe Blog creates the SAFE equivalent of Ebay or Amazon or any number sites that require payment in turn for a product be it legal or illegal by definition of the following statementâŚ
to overcome the shortfall of safecoin old forms of payment such as fiat and btc will be used slowing the adoption of safecoin as a form of payment on the network?
I guess my hopes are that safecoin would be the preferred form of payment for anything and everything on the network. After all there are already many more available than btc so perhaps large quantaties is not the issue but the current low value. I think that 452,552,412 MAID converted to safecoin with a healthy rise in value would make it possible to compete with older forms of payment right from the start. probable? who knows. Perhaps I am simply overzealous.
Having a hard time deciphering your question.
If a decentralized exchange such as SafeX is functioning fairly thoroughly, the SAFE Network can be used to enable trades via almost any type of currency, including fiat, I think. Safecoin will be preferred, of course, but other ways will be possible.
A truly decentralized system of exchanging communications and commerce will be revolutionizing in a bunch of ways. But Iâm thinking safecoin will be a while working into a broadly used currency, though it will be valued immediately. Of course, once divisibility is built in, that will change as well.
Iâm not trying to pretend foreknowledge or wisdom. Just riffing on what seems solid from where weâre at.
I am not sure that i had a question so much as I was âthinking out loudâ your points are logical. I guess i hope that if that particular comment is accurate that it does not work against safecoin adoption.
Iâm not worried about safecoin adoption. Itâs the SAFE Network that is the real prize and treasure. Safecoin is just the cherry on top. In other words, if the SAFE Network works and is useful, safecoin will take care of itself.
The question I think about often is that safe network and safe coin maybe too good, and the world is corrupt and no one wants a system you cant manipulate.
Heeh!
If I am a crook, I donât want to do business within a system that is safe from being corrupted.
If I am not a crook, I want to do business on a system that is safe from being corrupted.
So if you want to be safe and do business with folks who are not crooks, use the safe network.
Negative Interest Rates
Some countries are desperately turning to negative interest rates to stimulate spending. If my money is rotting away at the bank, Iâm motivated to convert it to an alternative with a better store of value.
What is a better store of value compared to rotting fiat currency?
IMO, timing couldnât be any better. Itâs like opening an ice cream stand during the hottest summer.
If Safecoin becomes a decent store of value, with no transaction costs, and gains global awareness⌠people would convert because itâs the best alternative to physical cash.
@dirvine wrote a blog describing Safecoin as âCash.â
Thereâs no transaction fee in a P2P physical exchange.
Money senders cleverly added themselves as the âmiddle manâ who are exclusive to the banking system. To this I say, âyour services are no longer required.â
Yeah, it is insane to see bankers putting up negative interest rates. They are really that desperate. Time to pull all of the fiat out of the banks, and invest into precious metals, cryptos, and real estates.
Global is already in depression. We are witnessing, and living through it right now. This is just the beginning. I am glad it is happening right now, the short period will be tough for a lot of people. But in long term, it is finally refreshing, and beginning of a new start.