Government reach?

I’ve been selling Safe Network in a Discord thread and wonder if somebody could elaborate on the given scenario. A friend is worried that the sharding of data across nodes could put users in peril. Given that somebody is putting illegal data (child porn) on the Safe Network. Government is able to pull that data to a computer. What prevents them from getting the node IPs that provide the shards to assemble the illegal file? Couldn’t they just go and arrest everyone who provided a shard for distribution of said content?

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I’ve been selling Safe Network in a Discord thread and wonder if somebody could elaborate on the given scenario. A friend is worried that the sharding of data across nodes could put users in peril. Given that somebody is putting illegal data (child porn) on the Safe Network. Government is able to pull that data to a computer. What prevents them from getting the node IPs that provide the shards to assemble the illegal file? Couldn’t they just go and arrest everyone who provided a shard for distribution of said content?

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TL;DR: If it bothers you wait and see!

I don’t think it’s easy to do this. The IPs of Elders are currently exposed, but it is Adults which host data and it is much harder to obtain their IPs.

However the question is better answered by asking would they do this if they had the IP of a computer that unknowingly held a shard from an illegal file?

You could ask the same about Tor nodes, or Torrents, where the illegal content is not necessarily encrypted or sharded.

I’m not aware of legal attacks on Tor nodes which route illegal traffic, but perhaps thats hard to prove.

I think people seeding illegal Torrents might have been targeted, I’m not sure, but those routing it?

Personally I think it’s hard to make a legal case against someone who has no knowledge of what the data in these shards is. It doesn’t worry me but some may choose to wait and see what happens rather than take that risk.

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?.. are the nodes that hold a certain xor stable.

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I agree it’s not likely if somebody distributes 1/1000 of a counterfeit 100 dollar bill that anybody would bother trying to prosecute them. They want to nab the printer and whole ring. Unless they actually found illegal content on a computer they could not prosecute and they would be hard pressed to figure which piece was the offensive piece sense it’s an
encrypted shard.

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Surely if you’ve received data from a node, you already know its IP?

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How many shards are created from a file? …that’s a good question because if it’s in the hundreds, chasing people down based upon IP addresses would create an extreme burden on their resources.

3 chunks at a minimum and encrypted.

How many postal workers have delivered the thumb drives etc with illegal material. Do they get charged. How many email servers have held the emails with this crap? Just because your node has a chopped up and encrypted piece of a file, does any court/authority actually believe you participated in this stuff.

Yea they may make noise about it to try and scare people but if the person is innocent otherwise then I cannot see anything coming from it.

NOTE: Keep this topic off child crimes or the post will be deleted, even if mentioning the crime type. Its because its an emotive topic and like to keep it where people can review the long discussions already had over it. Also the topic is not searchable by google and this way we don’t get the people who love blowing up such topics from coming into our forum to create a firestorm.

https://safenetforum.org/t/topic/7146/1

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Apparently there is some in the btc blockchain. Or so I read a few years back now.
I don’t see anyone running around arresting anyone who has a copy of that.

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To flip the question around, should ISPs be responsible for providing the hardware to route the dodgy data too? How about telcos providing interconnections? How about the creators of the operating systems that allowed the data to be downloaded? How about the app to view it?

The list goes on.

The question is probably whether you can be made aware of the dodgy data being present. If you can’t, then how can you be held responsible for dispersing it any more than those in the above list?

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In many cases ignorance is no excuse for the law… it can bare on outcomes before a magistrate however and in a sane world, would not be held against you.

That’s the crux right there.

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According to my friend this very thing is happening in Poland. Node software on the confiscated computer together with record of traffic would be enough evidence in Tor cases. I’m not aware of how Tor works but if it places complete, unencrypted files on the node this would explain it.

So they are going to round up all the others in my list above too? Are they being ignorant of what is passing through their data systems?

I have no idea what’s going on in those cases… I don’t believe the ISPs are being held as culpable.

That was solved a long time ago before the Internet, back with couriers and postal services. Its the common carrier clause. As long as the carrier is not filtering (modern terminology) as part of their service then they can apply for common carrier status and then not held responsible for bad stuff that maybe transported by them. Obviously any filtering based on government regulations does not affect the status. EG transportation of Li batteries by air, or explosive goods, etc

Its ignorance of the law is no excuse. Ignorance of what you carry does effect the outcome of a case. In some places and/or crimes this ignorance has little effect because its hard to prove ignorance in those cases since too many criminals use the excuse falsely.

A recent example is the actor who shot dead another person on set. The actor claims to be completely ignorant of the live round being there and most likely will not be guilty of a crime even though he physically killed a person.

It can place things unencrypted if an exit node. In many cases the claim that the files were only from the traffic passing through is false, there is plenty of files in addition. But the media or people reporting how bad things are will say all the files were due to (say) TOR but in fact nah the person had other files that really nailed them.

We need quality unbiased reports of what happened.

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