Forking the SAFEnetwork


#1

Hi. So if all of the current developments and code is open source, anyone can fork it and make another version of this network right? Does the patent by maidsafe foundation have any effects on what you can and can’t do?


#2

Yep, you are welcome to fork it and create another version, James, the various open source licenses we have in place enable that.


#3

It was always stated that the patents were to prevent another entity claiming ownership of the technology and prevent SAFE network existing.

So yes you can fork the network for public use and the limitation is that you cannot claim patents preventing others including Maidsafe and the safenetwork from using said technologies.

And what @nicklambert said. Beat me to it


#4

Very rare for me to ninja someone @neo, thanks for the opportunity :grinning: !


#5

So all of the code is on Github, you guys are not excluding any code at all? Only asking because I’m hearing some projects purposely hide some essential bits of the code to themselves and use Github as more of a shell for branding.


#6

Yes, although we do have some private code to play around with some things from time to time when we are forced to. That is infrequent though and that code does not normally get into SAFE.

That is definitely not something we do, all the code is there and every release people can see they have access to every single bit. If you check yourself you will see this is the case.


#7

Awesome!!! :smiley: So with the code right now available on Github, and with some servers set up(like you guys), anyone can set up an Alpha 2 version of the network exactly like you guys have set up now, am i right? I will try this soon enough so i guess we’ll find out either way!


#8

Yes you can, we have a load of scripts and the like to set that up, we do have some of those private though, well the ones where we have keys and access tokens, but they are easily reproducible by anyone to deploy testnets at scale quickly. It is also possible to just manually set them up as well. So anyone with a little bit of experience of something like digital ocean could create their own scripts easily.

To be fair though, we do a huge amount of work in the background when deciding what code will make up a testnet. It’s all possible, but during these phases, you will need a very deep understanding of the whole codebase. If you take the local tesnet setups though and just expand it you will see how it goes. It’s also a few hundred dollars a month running those nodes (not servers :wink: ).


#9

Do you have plans to make these available and more accessible with some basic instructions? Including how to generate your own access tokens and keys. Or would one need to first work at maidsafe for a few months to gather the knowledge to write this up publicly. I’ll volunteer if you need resource to do this.

:rofl: keep holding back that ocean.


#10

Exactly! The setup is described here: How to run a local test network. It is not limited to a local network and can be used to create a global one.


#11

That is standard digital ocean scripting, there are many ways to do this, but it’s not something we can spend time teaching people really. Not trying to be obtuse, but it is a typical automation via scripts almost any engineer can do for themselves. We have stuff for us to analyze what we want with each test and change these scripts with tests to specifically look for things or restart, add larger swap files, partially reboot the network whilst maintaining invariants and much more.,

Absolutely not, it is honestly just scripts, most are public, but we have some we change like the wind, a scratch area if you like and not one we wish to document etc.

[unrelated to he crux of your comment, which has been debated at length ;-),] Have you ever looked into the real story of king Canute btw, he did that to prove he was no god or at least the power of kings was not over nature, Funny how we rewrite history for our own ego. It allows us, humans, to show how much smarter we are than another human :wink:

This ^^^ 100% :slight_smile:


#12

Apparently I’m told setting up a fork version of it would take ages as the code is hard to understand and there are some private code(as you mentioned) . and MaidSafe Asia has been negotiating for over a year with the MaidSafe foundation and still have not set up their own version of the alpha. Can you confirm this is true? I really thought this project was truly open source but if no one can replicate it and amend everything on their terms, because of the fact it has some private code and some “very hard to understand without explanation” code, it undermines the open source philosophy(which I really liked about the project) a little bit. Don’t you think?


#13

By private code you are referring to the scripts to set up the test nodes on digital ocean? If so, then those scripts aren’t going to be part of the final network - once vaults are added … so IMO, that’s Maidsafe’s code, and not part of the Safe Network code … seems to me you need to find a few good network engineers to get it going if that’s what you aim to do … otherwise wait to fork until there are working vaults?


#14

What I read was that the private code is simply the parts of the scripts that have the server’s passwords and obviously they are kept private. And that the scripts are only part of the data centre server init and that its easy enough to do your self.

AFAIK there is no private code for the network and if you init the servers and load the code then you can run the network.

This is sounding like a backflip more than anything else. Anyone claiming they are going to run their own network would be expected to have a fair amount of expertise in the first place setting up their own data centre servers or personal computers with the code and be able to compile the code for themselves.


#15

Where did you read this? The project is open source and no negotiations are needed to set up a network. Of course the code isn’t ready yet for a decentralized one and you need to control the clients that can put data onto your network to prevent data spamming. But even that part is open source (gen_invites.rs)


#16

Both are false, anyone can set up their own network, many have. We even have instructions on running local network.

It is

They can, although it requires a smidgen of technical knowhow.

OK from somebody who has obvious issues in communicating I will try and explain. If you have never done a single line of code then this will not be simple, neither would run your own version of a tor or bitcoin network, do you consider them not open source also? In fact, we have had many community run testnets is AFAIK more than enough evidence that it is possible.

MaidSafe Asia or anyone could run a community testnet, there is no issue there. If folk want to write deploy scripts to deploy at scale then they can also do that. So your statement about MAidSafe Asia trying for a year is, in fact, a lie. You should not tell lies and if this was not from you then I would check your sources. If some person does not have the ability to run tests then it is their issue, we would help where we can, but we will not actually run the testnets for anyone, obviously. I think you need to ask yourself, did you ever follow any instructions to run local networks?

Are you seriously telling me that you have never done a line of code and now want to create your own version of SAFE and you are complaining it is not possible for you? I suspect your limited knowledge of computing is your Achilles heel.

I will not really want anyone wasting time with you any more @foreverjoyful as you have proven to be just a nuisance with an extremely low level of ability or experience. All you now do is slow us down, so there will be no more communication with you, so please stop sending messages to maidsafe staff as they will no longer respond, you have insulted most of them anyway, then ask for help.

I wish you well on your journey, but this is the end of you wasting our time if you cannot run a local network or tesnet or understand any of the instructions and then make these accusations you are beyond the help we can currently give.


#17

Excuse me, it’s not me who said that. I haven’t even tried. I was just asking some members who used to work at Maidsafe this is what they said. Why did you react so much? I’m simply asking if it is true as I truly don’t know. But your reactions is a bit weird. So have you guys had any dealings with MaidSafe Asia in setting up an alpha for them or not?

Anyway. Either way, don’t know why you seem so mad… I was just asking for some help in setting up the alpha with ONE of your team. Only have sent a few brief messages. If you don’t want to help it’s cool. I won’t bother you.


#18

OK! Thank you. And no problem. I will find my way. :slight_smile: sorry if I am perceived as wasting your time, I’m trying to help achieve somewhat similar visions of the project. Tho probably gonna be in a totally different way.


#19

Here are some words that I try and live by, they may help you on your way. Folks think I have great patience, but it’s more than that. I hope this is of use.

Is there for honest Poverty
That hings his head, an’ a’ that;
The coward-slave, we pass him by,
We dare be poor for a’ that!
For a’ that, an’ a’ that.
Our toils obscure an’ a’ that,
The rank is but the guinea’s stamp,
The Man’s the gowd for a’ that.

What though on hamely fare we dine,
Wear hoddin grey, an’ a that;
Gie fools their silks, and knaves their wine;
A Man’s a Man for a’ that:
For a’ that, and a’ that,
Their tinsel show, an’ a’ that;
The honest man, tho’ e’er sae poor,
Is king o’ men for a’ that.

Ye see yon birkie ca’d a lord,
Wha struts, an’ stares, an’ a’ that,
Tho’ hundreds worship at his word,
He’s but a coof for a’ that.
For a’ that, an’ a’ that,
His ribband, star, an’ a’ that,
The man o’ independent mind,
He looks an’ laughs at a’ that.

A Prince can mak a belted knight,
A marquis, duke, an’ a’ that!
But an honest man’s aboon his might –
Guid faith, he mauna fa’ that!
For a’ that, an’ a’ that,
Their dignities, an’ a’ that,
The pith o’ Sense an’ pride o’ Worth
Are higher rank than a’ that.

Then let us pray that come it may,
As come it will for a’ that,
That Sense and Worth, o’er a’ the earth
Shall bear the gree an’ a’ that.
For a’ that, an’ a’ that,
It’s comin yet for a’ that,
That Man to Man the warld o’er
Shall brithers be for a’ that.

It explains why we are ah Jack Thampsons bairns. It prevents name calling and provides some context to this life.

Anyway, good luck.


#20

Hmm. Why would you purposely avoid the most important question I asked about MaidSafe Asia…which is mainly the thing that spurred the post I made yesterday in the first place. A simple “no we have never had any dealings with them whatsoever in helping them setting up the alpha” is a much more clear and settling answer.