Discussion on gun laws

What if the law was that everyone HAS to carry a gun, and you start training in safety and shooting in elementary school? I could also argue that that alternate reality would be just as safe as the ban all guns reality.

That would be a very stupid law. Selling more guns won’t reduce murders. The culture of violence is the problem

”You don’t spread democracy with a barrel of a gun” Helen Thomas


I mean again, I could just say outlawing all guns wont stop murders all the same. At least if every single person had a gun, who is going to start shooting first? knowing you’re not going to get very far…
Don’t think theres ever been a place on earth or a point in time where people weren’t killing others over something or other. And tell me again what is the main reason people want to ban all guns? because of MASS shootings right? so yet again, when everyone has a gun… how MASS can shootings really get? The crazy guy who decides to go out a try might get 1 or 2 people (same as a guy with a knife in banned guns reality) :wink: :wink:

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So, taking this to another level: It would be your position also that all countries should have nuclear weapons for the same reason?

You pretty much sealed my arguement… since all the (major) countries already do, or have had, nukes at the same time as others and well…? no one launched because guess why? other guy would also launch and everyone get wrecked :slight_smile:
Sooo… thank you for providing real world proof of why my law is pretty flawless :stuck_out_tongue:

The point is not to stop “murders” in general. The point is to reduce murders caused by the fact that these toys are available everywhere in the country and almost to everyone. Sometimes it’s like people in the US think that life is a videogame. If you die you don’t respawn somewhere else lol

• Point 1. Again, selling more guns won’t reduce murders. You are ignoring one big variable in your basic equation (everyone armed=less murders) that is people. People are are unpredictable and uneducated. Guns are not toys. They require education and responsibility to be used. People are uneducated. That’s why in most countries they’re available just to police.

• Point 2. If everyone is armed like in your scenario, police wouldn’t exist or it wouldn’t be able to guarantee safety like now. Things that currently seem simple like stupid car-checking, documents searches etc… would require more suspicion by police. And more violence to solve security problems. That’s a reason why police in the US is more rude towards people.

Wouldn’t you be more worried knowing that every single person in front of you is armed? Yes I would. That’s a big obstacle for a police officer for doing its duty in safety condition

I’m really worried by people who think that arming an entire nation would solve murders or stop mass shooting. And as said, the problem is not just guns. It includes people and their veneration of violence. People need education

So how to reduce murders? Sell less guns and more books


I didn’t say anything about all MAJOR countries, I asked about ALL countries, same as your argument of guns for everyone. By the way, America has already tried this. It was called the Wild West. Didn’t work out so well. Thankfully, civilization and good reason eventually prevailed.

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In my original comment I did say “and start gun safety education from elementary school” :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:

you say “police wouldn’t be able to gaurantee safety” now… come on… when in the history or the universe was anyone able to GAURANTEE anything?? let alone safety? the answer to that is never, as I pointed out already, in banned gun universe, no police can ever gaurantee you dont get murdered by crazy guy the goes out with a knife one day.

you say “police wouldn’t be needed” … YES good! that is the world I want to live in, with no police, so A+ from me there.

Just to point out, you haven’t made a counter arguement as to how my idea would NOT stop mass murders. Like I said, how far is crazy guy going to get when he starts shooting off with everyone around him having a gun ready to put him down fast?

No matter what any of us say here, we have no idea if banning all guns or giving everyone guns reduces the scale of killings, because we can’t live both of those realities side by side. But none of you can ignore the logic of the arguement.

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Extrapolation… major countries… all countries… either way we can extract predictions and patterns, and like I said we can see that no one pulled the trigger because the other guy would also pull the trigger, ending bad for everyone.
I don’t know what the point is in referencing the wild west, since in our current discussion there is no difference between the wild west and today in terms of possibility of gun ownership. Back then anyone could have a gun on them, today also anyone can have a gun on them. I happened to believe many people choose not to because the majority of the sheep population believes that police are magically everywhere watching over their sweet dreams and ready to come to their rescue… clearly not the case, physically impossible, etc etc… So if the vast majority were trained in safety and gun education from a young age well, no one knows, but I say we’d be better off.

Your argument falls apart when you consider the fact that many mass murderers have had no intention of surviving the carnage anyway, taking their own life in the end. The mere possibility of them meeting lethal resistance would have had no influence on their actions.

Psychology Today, Feb. 22, 2018

“Tragically, both suicide and mass public shootings are on the rise in the U.S. There is an insidious connection between these phenomena, as demonstrated by the fact that mass public shootings such as the October, 2017, Las Vegas massacre often end with the perpetrator taking his own life at the scene.”

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The statistics are there to prove you wrong: Gun Violence in America.

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How can it prove my idea wrong when my idea has never been tried? There has never been a law, nor has more than 90% of the population chosen to carry firearms with them at any point in time. So…? that statistic shows…yes… the unbalanced problem of people with guns and people without.

And yet… my idea still covers this aspect of suicidal mass murders, going right back to my original thought… the crazy guy who goes out planning on shooting, might get 1 or 2, but since everyone around him has a gun also, he’s probably going to get taken down…

And just for good measure… let me state AGAIN, in magical universe with no guns, guy can still run around and stab a “mass” amount of people to death with sharp instrument…sooo…

So you’d teach children how to use guns? Honestly that’s psychopathic and stupid

Police does its job pretty well in many west countries. Guarantee doesn’t mean 100% safety, that’s not possible anywhere and with any alternative.

No. That’s not what I wrote. Police is armed in order to guarantee safety. They are “educated”

No, it would definitely not be good

Yes I already answered to your point. As told, you are excluding the people factor from your equation. You’re giving everyone a lethal weapon and you pretend people to know perfectly when and how to use guns in your scenario. Moreover you suppose people to be armed “equally” in your scenario??! What if your psychopathic is the most advanced in both military technique and weapons equipment in your scenario? Again, there are thousands of variables that would cause more problems instead of solving them with your hypothetical solution. You would turn the country into a Wild West.

If you’ve read the website I linked to, you see for example ‘Access to a gun increased the risk of death by suicide by three times’. So indeed maybe your idea has never been tried, but I really don’t understand how giving everyone a gun will decrease the number of suicides for example. What are you going to do: don’t shoot yourself, or I will shoot you?

Already said this… NEITHER you nor I know what will cause more problems, or which would be the better future. Reguardless of all of us thinking we know the best outcome, we don’t… you don’t… I don’t… No one responding does. But banning everything doesn’t solve…dun dun dun… the human problem. I know how we’ll be safe, if our good faith protectors the police just lock every single one of us in a jail cell then we’ll never get hurt and no one can ever hurt us? Ban houses. Or better yet life.

Police do their job… yup, would they still do their job in banned gun universe? yes… how about every has gun universe? yup… they would still do their job… why? because their job is to try and help people. No guarantee they are going to actually protect anyone, but they are there to help and try, weather we all have guns… knives… or nothing.

Oh wait… now we’re solving how to stop people from suicide? seems a bit bigger than guns…

Yes, making bigger problems smaller by taking the guns away.
Edit: to reformulate what I quoted earlier, backed by statistics: ‘No access to a gun decreased the risk of death by suicide by three times’.
Edit2: Taking away a lot of the guns away by stricter regulation, not all of them of course.

Whoa…whoa… did you really just say suicide is solved by taking away guns? because… come on… you HAVE to see how insane that sounds.

Scenario A
Everyone has a gun. Regardless of their basic reason, people can easily kill someone .
No restrictions, everyone is able to access to heavy weapons too. The weight of military education and the destruction power of their weapons are determined by their free choice

Scenario B
Guns are restricted. Illegal gun traffic is heavily monitored. Guns are given just to police.

Murders have more chance to happen in scenario A or B?