Community Exchange Listing Fund

It’s always been possible. What I see now is OMNI CEX is so hard, so expensive that perhaps if erc20 was cheap and very secure and reduced CEX listing costs then it’s worth considering. It also buys some DEX as well. So could be a wise move the reduce ongoing costs.

I don’t see this as CEX verses DEX as such, although some will frame it like that. I am just looking at a way to get on more exchanges (hopefully without paying) and perhaps with less friction.

It’s a balance, if gas fees go mental etc. but the thing is we are in a boat with many others, so level playing field.

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There are already sidechains (matic) associated with the main ETH blockchain. Fees there are super cheap.

https://docs.matic.network/docs/home/blockchain-basics/sidechain/


Privacy. Security. Freedom

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@BambooGarden may be able to break the impasse here. They obviously are deep into the Ethereum ecosystem and would likely have a good handle on what benefits (or not) providing a Maid-ERC20 token allowing decentralised developers and liquidity to move from that very large ecosystem over to SN. Could the Bamboo fund manage a MaidSafe backed straight token swap project (i.e. not a complicated third party Omni wrapping system)? I would imagine it could be the one project that enables so many more projects down the road, devs and liquidity being the spark.

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Wrapped tokens can easily be issued but most important feature must be security and decentralization.

To what degree would we deem something decentralized?

  1. If anybody can join as a decentralized node it could create an 51% attack (or something similar where attacker has n-of-k keys required to authorized a transaction). Having a few reputable but independent members run their own validation node would significantly help to make the swap more secure. If some nodes go missing or down for maintenance the swap can still continue.

  2. Too many required multi signatures can also cause problems, what if people in future decide to stop running a node, also more signatures can increase transaction costs. Also running a full node is not super cheap so where would these long-term node be paid from (donations? own pocket?)

  3. People should be able to easily maintain their node, without someone else having to get access to all the data. If there are important updates, that should be peer reviewed, upgrading should go without losing any keys or significant down time.

I could create a ERC20 Swap right now, running multiple independent nodes, but in long run I’m not sure how it will be sustained economically and also a big responsibility to maintain everything.

So there should be a small core group of people that know about the mechanism of what atomic swaps are, how omni node works, how erc20 contracts work and how both of those chains meet and interact.
If we have a few people that can actively share the burden of making sure things go well it would certainly make everything more feasible.

As far as I know MAID requires a full omni node to operate, people mention about easy atomic swaps but wonder how decentralized this is? If omnicore node is running at the core then is this service still ultimately centralized? I really want to reduce this repeated failure of CEX and Centralized points of control in general. No more hacks and missing coins because people got control to a single centralized server and money gone in vain.

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This poll is about raising funds to list to CEX only.

I recommend you start a poll and organize an effort to do so.

I was thanking you for clarifying with Secretariat415.

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I do think switching to ERC20 would make things easier, but I’m not expecting any magic to happen.

I think for the most exchanges there are 2 main reasons for not listing / delisting.

  1. We have a fixed amount of tokens in circulation at the moment. Without miners/farmers/stakers, there will be less liquidity and less volume, period.
  2. We’re privacy focussed, which is something most exchanges try to move away from given the legal actions they might face (maybe even in the background that we’re not aware off).

I’m not sure how long we’re out to the point where we can swap our omni to native SNT’s, but I can’t imagine it taking several more years. I’m just not sure if its worth the hassle to get it done now.

The first thing we should do and put effort in is finding out why exchanges have been delisting us in the past, or why they’re refusing to list us now. This will take a bunch of effort, and probably without a satisfying answer 50% of the times. Yet, I think it’s worth diving in.

Thanks for the reply. I will post a separate topic with David’s suggestion. :dragon:


Privacy. Security. Freedom

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Interesting https://twitter.com/vcorem/status/1381537750298591235?s=20
https://twitter.com/vcorem/status/1381574537800744961?s=20

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This is also my dream. I hate, I hate when people tell me they lost their money in a centralized exchange. It is disgusting to have to beg for your own money:


Privacy. Security. Freedom

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Also there are super cheap gas (x1000 cheaper) very fast transactions with Harmony(one) blockchain and their VenomDAO (Viper) dex

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Hello Everyone,

This community never ceases to amaze. Pulling together, organising, and putting hands in pockets for this project is just what we’ve come to expect, but it doesn’t make it any less amazing each time it happens.

The area of exchange listings, and anything to do with MaidSafeCoin, does come with some legal obligations for MaidSafe the company though. In particular, any new listing on a centralised exchange would require MaidSafe to be a party in a contract with the exchange, and take on certain legal liabilities.

Listing fees would have to be paid in accordance with this agreement, and would necessitate MaidSafe’s involvement in handling the funds in some way; which would require legal scrutiny, accounting, governance and the like.

It’s a nice problem to have in some regards, but as with the Bamboo Garden Fund, does take a fair amount of administration and organisation.

And as we have described before, any new exchange listing comes with its own administrative and legal costs, of varying degrees.

On top of that, there are certain things, as a UK business we just cannot do. This includes things like ‘market-making’, being a liquidity provider, or any action that would—or could be interpreted as—manipulating the coin price.

Then there are things we have to be very cautious about: namely making public statements about what we financially have available, or are willing to commit to be listed on exchanges, regardless of the source. As I’m sure you can appreciate, this does make finding good-faith, mutually beneficial agreements a touch more difficult.

It’s also one of the reasons we have an on-going stance of not paying listing fees. It is fundamental to the project—one of the reasons it exists—to break down barriers to information, and allow individuals to sidestep the gatekeepers to the digital economy. So we have to have an awareness, and to be able to discern the difference between partnering with businesses who have complementary skills, for mutual benefit, and when we are just paying a middleman for market access: establishing the new gatekeepers.

Listing fees, by any measure, are eye-wateringly expensive. It’s money that could otherwise be put to use completing the Network, or perhaps building the new financial systems of the future: without the middlemen.

While we can, and will, countenance contributing to the cost of getting MAID (or soon Safe Network Tokens) integrated with exchanges, say by paying for some development time to get things up and running, we continue to stand by our rule of not paying listing fees.

It’s awesome to have been able to add on a new exchange recently, and expand access to MAID to the US. We are delighted.

And while we do continue to explore and negotiate further listings, we also continue to exercise caution when suggesting that listing on more exchanges will have a direct positive impact on coin price.

Our ultimate aim is to give you all the tools to make the digital economy and trading platforms of the future with no middlemen involved. So what we need to build and how we can empower the community to make it happen will be at the front of our minds, and remains our primary focus.

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In many ways, I think this makes the Safe Network one of the most truly decentralized out there. :blush:

Our goal should not be to raise the price. Rather we should focus on increasing awareness of value. Additional exchanges will help to provide additional liquidity, which will make it easier for people to access the market.

Research into exchange listings is showing that many exchanges are willing to waive fees for Top 50 projects. As awareness of the Safe Network’s value increases, it will be easier to get listed on more exchanges. Let’s all think about what we can do to help increase awareness of the Safe Network’s value. :smile:

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I want to clarify the above as I feel the previous quote used is out of context and misleading.

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What do you mean? Are you referring to me? If anything, what I wrote agrees with what you quoted. Could you clarify?

Also, if Maidsafe doesn’t want help, I’m happy to stop providing it. Every morning I wake up, it seems some one is angry about something.

I think what Sharon is trying to say is that when you quote “listing on more exchanges will have a direct positive impact on coin price.”, it may seem to other community members that MaidSafe is saying that listing on exchanges will directly have a positive impact on the price, while they’re trying to say the exact opposite. She’s just quoting the entire piece to see the context in which it has been said.

At the same time I think we’re all on the same page here, we (Me, Sharon, Soton & the Maidsafe team) don’t want to spend time and effort on something that will increase the price in an unnatural way. This might be something short term holders want, but for the health of the project, the network, and long term price stability we should all aim on organically increasing traffic and awareness. After all, it’s the market that sets the price, not us.

That being said I think everyone has valid points. Personally I think that with the P2PB2B listing, we now have 3 exchanges that should prevent Maidsafe from not being tradable anymore in the near future. I feel our main goal now should be to raise awareness which will strengthen our position towards exchange / wrapped / anything else in the future. Paid listings now might/will become free of charge in the future once we reclaim our place in the #50 CMC.

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If you click on the quote, it will show you exactly where the quote came from in the original post. The original post is right above it. I don’t see how this is “misleading” as if to imply that I’m trying to deliberately deceive people. That’s unnecessary and unfair.

@sharontannahill, did you have a problem specifically with what I wrote? If so, I’d like to clarify the issue.

Why would you do that?

All jokes aside, we’re all doing great work here. No diamonds without pressure <3.

Nobody is saying or implying that. It’s all good, but we just need to be very careful here.

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If it is genuinely getting you down, no one would think badly of you if you wanted to step away. You’ve done some brilliant work, but it isn’t worth making yourself miserable over.

Ofc, I hope you carry on, but it feels like tensions are higher than they should be. We are all trying to move this project in a direction we feel is positive.

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No Sotros, no problem with what you wrote.

As I said, I felt the quote you picked up wasn’t in context and therefore misleading.

As pointed out by others, the way you quoted expressed the opposite of the company’s opinion.

My only objective was to provide clarity. I hope you understand.

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