A Second (vampire) network attack - discussion

Do you think the opportunity to grab our 15% pre-mining MAID is not a sufficient motive?

Not if the next 15% is easily earned in the first 1-3 years by anyone with a vault.

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Why should they farm 15% in someone else’s network, when they can farm 30% in their own?

Because there is only one original.

They are NOT grabbing “our” 15% pre-mining. We still get it.

They have a worthless coin and 1 year of data uploads to catch up. Coin is worthless because you gave it away and who pays for uploads when they got plenty from the giveaway. Many have hundreds of ETH addresses or even 1000’s. So they will not buy new coin and farmers get next to nothing or nothing when they try to sell

Also worthless because you gave it to crypto people who are not the best audience for a data storage and Internet replacement network.

It’d take another year to catch up if anyone took it seriously and only uploaded to it

The code is the same. Your and my coins will not be there…

You could fork the BTC code tomorrow, start with a fresh blockchain and genesis node. At this point who would use it? Safenetwork has been establishing a base of trust over many years that any competitor will need to build on its own to catch up to. Imo, the only way that a second network could possibly compete is to offer the MAID snapshot terms for their network genesis.

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and even in the best case you are trying to suggest… it’s not a big deal… it’s just an alt.

It might appeal to some niche, which only cares for their data… but I cannot see that it would be viable over the long term as the data on the larger principal network would be an attractive and draw people away.

The idea is just a cheap attempt to grab profit… it’s not even original… it’s a copy of the motive that spawned too many copy coins.

The appeal to reset the basis of the coin, is disingenuous to the developers.

You would do better looking for opportunity on the main network, than waste time spawning a second; third; forth; etc clone.

There is plenty of opportunity - seek a route to add value, rather than detract from it.

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That’s what I saying here. A Safe network that distributes coins for free and has access to the huge DeFi market on the Ethereum network adds value…

I don’t know what the point of the discussion is…

You’ve titled it attack… and then trying to defend that it adds value… and pretending to play devil’s advocate … but it’s a weak argument… and the repetitive is not getting more interesting!

I’m going to unsub from this thread.

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I’m sorry you won’t see the answer, but I’ll post it for other people anyway.

The attack is on people’s money, our money. It aims to steal the value of our money by stealing our farmers through something that adds value to their network - the ETH DeFi market and its liquidity.

I dont understand how you cannot see Dimitars argument as legit.

There simply will be a rich entity, motivated by greed and profit who will relaunch Safenetwork and will not respect MAID holders.

One of the ways how this attack could be successfull is to premine, give away for free and secure by his own farms.

All above legit IMO…

Can we now talk how to reduce the success of above strategy? As I understand it, its mostly what Dimitar is talking about.

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That’s what I’m talking about.

We all have access to different knowledge. For example, to my great surprise, I saw how Crypto.com premine 100% their currency CRO and gave me thousands of it.

One year later, these thousands of coins cost over 1,000 euros, and their coin is in the top 10.

In my opinion, it is reasonable to discuss an attack in which some will try to steal our farmers and the value of our coins through such a scheme…

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Ha…

Why these days these kinds of wired topic raise?

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Many companies pay good money to digital mercenaries to try and disrupt their network by any means at their disposal. This is just good preventive maintenance. If a company is not doing that to test their defenses then they are being remiss and inviting trouble down the road. @Dimitar is doing it for free. We should be thanking him for bringing these scenarios to the table for discussion now instead of later, when it might be too late.

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SAFE makes all blockchains obsolete with a single immutable sequence datatype. Perhaps another datatype could be proposed that makes the entire ETH DeFi ecosystem obsolete? :thinking:

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Ethereum is a slow blockchain. The billions of $ that people have locked up there are valuable. A mountain of money. This mountain will one day move into the Safe Network, but now and in the next 1-10 years it is locked in the etherium network of millions of people.

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This is not an attack, it’s a competition. The newcomer is trying to compete. In any competition the winner depends on ‘who’ is competing and ‘what’ they do, which in this scenario is not really clear enough.

Seems like the crux of it lies in

Why would this be more competitive than the initial format of the original network? Genuine question. I can’t really see how some number of ethereum users (or other set of users) is more competitive than some number of initial original network users. Can you please explain that part a bit more?

Why is this such a big point for you these days? Bitcoin has much more liquidity than ethereum. Gold more than bitcoin. Shares more than gold. Derivatives more than shares… What is it about ethereum that is so important?

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I am an ethereum user. I’ve never heard of the SAFE network.

One day I open my wallet and see a new airdrop. 1 REAL coin. Against it I see a price of 100 dollar. (Yes the price is taken from UniSwap, where the third party has added liquidity 1 REAL coin = 100).

I check CoinMarketCap and see the site of the REAL coin. I’m going to the REAL coin site.

I’m downloading the REAL Browser and the REAL Wallet. I see that for 1 REAL Coin I get 100 gigabytes stored forever. Wow. I tell all my friends.

The same thing is experienced by 1 million people at the same time. Airdrop.

Yes, somewhere on planet Earth there is a group of people, without advertising money, who are developing the Safe Network, the official open source, but I don’t know about them.

Now how likely is this attack? I have no idea.

Is this attack possible? It is certainly possible.

Of course, everyone is free to judge for themselves how much is possible. If you feel it is 0%, please do not feel obliged to comment on the topic.

Your opinion has been heard and noted.

I don’t see what more anyone you can add to the discussion if you feel the 0% probability. This is not possible for you (general statement, not you specific @mav) and there is no point in wasting your time on this topic.

For other people who feel such an attack is possible, let’s discuss what we can do. Thank you!

:love:

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Probably you’d sell the coin. It quickly becomes worthless. Nobody uploads. The network cannot be sustained with a low coin price. Original creators stop maintaining. Data is lost. Is this possible? I’d say (based on greed) it’s likely.

I think you raise fair points, that’s why I debate them here.